Episode 2: the EntMgr Green Light!!

Here is another episode of a typical day for me as a DBA ...

Boss: I got a call from Mary that the database is down.
Me: Hold on while I check ...
Me: Just a sec while I open a cmd prompt ... sqlplus "/ as sysdba" ....
Boss: Don't do that! -- go check the green light in OEM!
Me: That's for babies.
Boss: That is our documented procedure.
Me: But it's faster for me this way.
Boss: Please follow our documented procedure.
Me: FUMING

Two hours later ...

Boss: What are you working on?
Me: Looking through index_stats to see if any indexes need rebuilding.
Boss: Check with the vendor first to see if they allow that.
Me: Don't worry, it's just normal routine DBA stuff.
Boss: Still, please check.
Me: Don't worry, it won't affect functionality -- they won't care either way.
Boss: Still, please check.

Time to look for a new job -- this is a romper room Oracle shop
Dom.

"Domenic G." wrote in message
news:c7e08a19.0311061812.6659e5dd-at-posting.google.c om...
> Here is another episode of a typical day for me as a DBA ...
>
> Boss: I got a call from Mary that the database is down.
> Me: Hold on while I check ...
> Me: Just a sec while I open a cmd prompt ... sqlplus "/ as sysdba" ....
> Boss: Don't do that! -- go check the green light in OEM!
> Me: That's for babies.
> Boss: That is our documented procedure.
> Me: But it's faster for me this way.
> Boss: Please follow our documented procedure.
> Me: FUMING
>
> Two hours later ...
>
> Boss: What are you working on?
> Me: Looking through index_stats to see if any indexes need rebuilding.
> Boss: Check with the vendor first to see if they allow that.
> Me: Don't worry, it's just normal routine DBA stuff.
> Boss: Still, please check.
> Me: Don't worry, it won't affect functionality -- they won't care either
way.
> Boss: Still, please check.
>
> Time to look for a new job -- this is a romper room Oracle shop
> Dom.

Well, Dom: you only have yourself to blame for the last one. Indexes
shouldn't need rebuilding at the best of time (yawn, yawn)!

Also, strange thing about documented procedures... they're there for a
reason. A company's ISO9001 certification could be up for grabs if the
procedures aren't followed. And whilst they may seem stupid to you, they're
there to allow someone to perform the same function as you even were you to
fall under a bus. Someone for whom sqlplus is not perhaps such a familiar
tool.

So I tend to agree with your boss: if that's what the documented procedures
say should happen, that's what should happen. There will, of course, be a
documented procedure for how you go about modifying other documented
procedures. So that's where the effort should have been directed.

I learnt this a long time ago: procedures give you transparency and
visibility. They might not get the job done as fast or as simply as it might
be, but a company can't survive for long depending on the invisible and
opaque innate genius of its staff.

Regards
HJR

"Domenic G." wrote in message
news:c7e08a19.0311061812.6659e5dd-at-posting.google.c om...
> Here is another episode of a typical day for me as a DBA ...
>
> Boss: I got a call from Mary that the database is down.
> Me: Hold on while I check ...
> Me: Just a sec while I open a cmd prompt ... sqlplus "/ as sysdba" ....
> Boss: Don't do that! -- go check the green light in OEM!
> Me: That's for babies.
> Boss: That is our documented procedure.
> Me: But it's faster for me this way.
> Boss: Please follow our documented procedure.
> Me: FUMING
>
> Two hours later ...
>
> Boss: What are you working on?
> Me: Looking through index_stats to see if any indexes need rebuilding.
> Boss: Check with the vendor first to see if they allow that.
> Me: Don't worry, it's just normal routine DBA stuff.
> Boss: Still, please check.
> Me: Don't worry, it won't affect functionality -- they won't care either
way.
> Boss: Still, please check.
>
> Time to look for a new job -- this is a romper room Oracle shop
> Dom.

Well, Dom: you only have yourself to blame for the last one. Indexes
shouldn't need rebuilding at the best of time (yawn, yawn)!

Also, strange thing about documented procedures... they're there for a
reason. A company's ISO9001 certification could be up for grabs if the
procedures aren't followed. And whilst they may seem stupid to you, they're
there to allow someone to perform the same function as you even were you to
fall under a bus. Someone for whom sqlplus is not perhaps such a familiar
tool.

So I tend to agree with your boss: if that's what the documented procedures
say should happen, that's what should happen. There will, of course, be a
documented procedure for how you go about modifying other documented
procedures. So that's where the effort should have been directed.

I learnt this a long time ago: procedures give you transparency and
visibility. They might not get the job done as fast or as simply as it might
be, but a company can't survive for long depending on the invisible and
opaque innate genius of its staff.

Regards
HJR

"Domenic G." wrote in message
news:c7e08a19.0311061812.6659e5dd-at-posting.google.c om...
> Here is another episode of a typical day for me as a DBA ...
>
> Boss: I got a call from Mary that the database is down.
> Me: Hold on while I check ...
> Me: Just a sec while I open a cmd prompt ... sqlplus "/ as sysdba" ....
> Boss: Don't do that! -- go check the green light in OEM!
> Me: That's for babies.
> Boss: That is our documented procedure.
> Me: But it's faster for me this way.
> Boss: Please follow our documented procedure.
> Me: FUMING
>
> Two hours later ...
>
> Boss: What are you working on?
> Me: Looking through index_stats to see if any indexes need rebuilding.
> Boss: Check with the vendor first to see if they allow that.
> Me: Don't worry, it's just normal routine DBA stuff.
> Boss: Still, please check.
> Me: Don't worry, it won't affect functionality -- they won't care either
way.
> Boss: Still, please check.
>
> Time to look for a new job -- this is a romper room Oracle shop
> Dom.

Hi Dom,

Interesting, you should be a playwright

I've a few of questions regarding your normal routine DBA stuff.

How long does it take you to validate structure all your indexes, what
resources does it consume, what availability issues do you have as a result,
how much DBA time is spent running and analysing the results ?

What criteria do you use to regard an index worthy of rebuilding ?

How long does it take you to rebuild all such indexes, what resources does
it consume, what availability issues do you have as a result, how much DBA
time is spent rebuilding such indexes?

What benchmarks do you perform before the rebuild (ie. what performance
issues are you experiencing), what benchmarks do you perform after the
rebuild (ie. what has the rebuild achieved, what performance gains are you
experiencing that's justifying the rebuilds) ?

After rebuilding these indexes, how often and within what time periods are
you finding that these indexes generally need rebuilding again ?

Have you considered coalescing ?

Are you confident that the cost-benefits of such activity is in your favour
?

...... yes, they kinda leading questions ........

Cheers

Your Boss

"Domenic G." wrote in message
news:c7e08a19.0311061812.6659e5dd-at-posting.google.c om...
> Here is another episode of a typical day for me as a DBA ...
>
> Boss: I got a call from Mary that the database is down.
> Me: Hold on while I check ...
> Me: Just a sec while I open a cmd prompt ... sqlplus "/ as sysdba" ....
> Boss: Don't do that! -- go check the green light in OEM!
> Me: That's for babies.
> Boss: That is our documented procedure.
> Me: But it's faster for me this way.
> Boss: Please follow our documented procedure.
> Me: FUMING
>
> Two hours later ...
>
> Boss: What are you working on?
> Me: Looking through index_stats to see if any indexes need rebuilding.
> Boss: Check with the vendor first to see if they allow that.
> Me: Don't worry, it's just normal routine DBA stuff.
> Boss: Still, please check.
> Me: Don't worry, it won't affect functionality -- they won't care either
way.
> Boss: Still, please check.
>
> Time to look for a new job -- this is a romper room Oracle shop
> Dom.

Hi Dom,

Interesting, you should be a playwright

I've a few of questions regarding your normal routine DBA stuff.

How long does it take you to validate structure all your indexes, what
resources does it consume, what availability issues do you have as a result,
how much DBA time is spent running and analysing the results ?

What criteria do you use to regard an index worthy of rebuilding ?

How long does it take you to rebuild all such indexes, what resources does
it consume, what availability issues do you have as a result, how much DBA
time is spent rebuilding such indexes?

What benchmarks do you perform before the rebuild (ie. what performance
issues are you experiencing), what benchmarks do you perform after the
rebuild (ie. what has the rebuild achieved, what performance gains are you
experiencing that's justifying the rebuilds) ?

After rebuilding these indexes, how often and within what time periods are
you finding that these indexes generally need rebuilding again ?

Have you considered coalescing ?

Are you confident that the cost-benefits of such activity is in your favour
?

...... yes, they kinda leading questions ........

Cheers

Your Boss

Couple of comments
"Domenic G." wrote in message
news:c7e08a19.0311061812.6659e5dd-at-posting.google.c om...
> Here is another episode of a typical day for me as a DBA ...
>
> Boss: I got a call from Mary that the database is down.
> Me: Hold on while I check ...
> Me: Just a sec while I open a cmd prompt ... sqlplus "/ as sysdba" ....
> Boss: Don't do that! -- go check the green light in OEM!
> Me: That's for babies.
> Boss: That is our documented procedure.
> Me: But it's faster for me this way.
> Boss: Please follow our documented procedure.
> Me: FUMING

I'm all in favour of documented procedures myself. If the procedure is poor
then surely the appropriate response is to produce a revised procedure, test
it and update the procedures documentation. After all if I went into a bank
and said Can I have $2000 cash from my account please, and they accepted a
letter from my mother as proof of identity, I'd be a bit peeved. And yes a
letter from my mother would be reliable evidence.

>
> Two hours later ...
>
> Boss: What are you working on?
> Me: Looking through index_stats to see if any indexes need rebuilding.
> Boss: Check with the vendor first to see if they allow that.
> Me: Don't worry, it's just normal routine DBA stuff.
> Boss: Still, please check.
> Me: Don't worry, it won't affect functionality -- they won't care either
way.
> Boss: Still, please check.

If I were a vendor I might well care. Why might I care?

1. You are proposing to do a lot of work on the database, for probably no
benefit and at some cost.
2. What happens if you do 'ALTER INDEX REBUILD '.
3. What about alter index rebuild compress 1;

In addition 'routine dba stuff' can easily be excluded by vendors.
Collecting and keeping stats up to date, routine dba task but not a good
idea in a siebel shop.

> Time to look for a new job -- this is a romper room Oracle shop
> Dom.

I think I have a history of not especially linking GUIs or strange demands
from vendors but you seem to be describing a shop that

1. documents its procedures and insists employees follow them
2. ensures that it doesn't break support contracts.

Seems mature and sensible to me.


--
Niall Litchfield
Oracle DBA
Audit Commission Uk

Couple of comments
"Domenic G." wrote in message
news:c7e08a19.0311061812.6659e5dd-at-posting.google.c om...
> Here is another episode of a typical day for me as a DBA ...
>
> Boss: I got a call from Mary that the database is down.
> Me: Hold on while I check ...
> Me: Just a sec while I open a cmd prompt ... sqlplus "/ as sysdba" ....
> Boss: Don't do that! -- go check the green light in OEM!
> Me: That's for babies.
> Boss: That is our documented procedure.
> Me: But it's faster for me this way.
> Boss: Please follow our documented procedure.
> Me: FUMING

I'm all in favour of documented procedures myself. If the procedure is poor
then surely the appropriate response is to produce a revised procedure, test
it and update the procedures documentation. After all if I went into a bank
and said Can I have $2000 cash from my account please, and they accepted a
letter from my mother as proof of identity, I'd be a bit peeved. And yes a
letter from my mother would be reliable evidence.

>
> Two hours later ...
>
> Boss: What are you working on?
> Me: Looking through index_stats to see if any indexes need rebuilding.
> Boss: Check with the vendor first to see if they allow that.
> Me: Don't worry, it's just normal routine DBA stuff.
> Boss: Still, please check.
> Me: Don't worry, it won't affect functionality -- they won't care either
way.
> Boss: Still, please check.

If I were a vendor I might well care. Why might I care?

1. You are proposing to do a lot of work on the database, for probably no
benefit and at some cost.
2. What happens if you do 'ALTER INDEX REBUILD '.
3. What about alter index rebuild compress 1;

In addition 'routine dba stuff' can easily be excluded by vendors.
Collecting and keeping stats up to date, routine dba task but not a good
idea in a siebel shop.

> Time to look for a new job -- this is a romper room Oracle shop
> Dom.

I think I have a history of not especially linking GUIs or strange demands
from vendors but you seem to be describing a shop that

1. documents its procedures and insists employees follow them
2. ensures that it doesn't break support contracts.

Seems mature and sensible to me.


--
Niall Litchfield
Oracle DBA
Audit Commission Uk

> Well, Dom: you only have yourself to blame for the last one. Indexes
> shouldn't need rebuilding at the best of time (yawn, yawn)!

Says who? Sequenced-based indexes get lopsided fairly quickly if
they're not reverse key, and indexes should be rebuilt when a high
percentage of the rows in the leaves have been deleted.

Documented procedures are for monkeys who don't know what they're
doing. Not for experienced DBAs who do. They're meant for the
backups when I'm on vacation. The documented procedures don't tell me
what to do when I notice a lock mode of 4 on a table.

> Well, Dom: you only have yourself to blame for the last one. Indexes
> shouldn't need rebuilding at the best of time (yawn, yawn)!

Says who? Sequenced-based indexes get lopsided fairly quickly if
they're not reverse key, and indexes should be rebuilt when a high
percentage of the rows in the leaves have been deleted.

Documented procedures are for monkeys who don't know what they're
doing. Not for experienced DBAs who do. They're meant for the
backups when I'm on vacation. The documented procedures don't tell me
what to do when I notice a lock mode of 4 on a table.

>
> Hi Dom,
>
> Interesting, you should be a playwright
>
> I've a few of questions regarding your normal routine DBA stuff.
>
> How long does it take you to validate structure all your indexes, what
> resources does it consume, what availability issues do you have as a result,
> how much DBA time is spent running and analysing the results ?
>
> What criteria do you use to regard an index worthy of rebuilding ?

deleted leaf rows / total rows > 20 per cent
or
sequence based index that isn't reverse key needs rebuilding every so
often to rebalance it
or
level is too deep relative to # of rows in table.

not long to rebuild the indexes - relatively small Database.
>
> What benchmarks do you perform before the rebuild (ie. what performance
> issues are you experiencing), what benchmarks do you perform after the
> rebuild (ie. what has the rebuild achieved, what performance gains are you
> experiencing that's justifying the rebuilds) ?

that's hard to measure -- doesn't mean you shouldn't do it. like oil
changes on your car -- do you see the immediate benefit?
>
> After rebuilding these indexes, how often and within what time periods are
> you finding that these indexes generally need rebuilding again ?

like i said, i don't rebuild all of them -- looks like you're
abandoning your databases.
>
> Have you considered coalescing ?

no i use local extent management
>
> Are you confident that the cost-benefits of such activity is in your favour
> ?

i have to keep busy.
>
> ..... yes, they kinda leading questions ........
>
> Cheers
>
> Your Boss